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Poster:
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 NoiseCollector |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 12:16:15pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Shale oil...
A 2005 estimate set the total world resources of oil shale at 411 gigatons — enough to yield 2.8 to 3.3 trillion barrelsof shale oil.
This exceeds the world's proven conventional oil reserves, estimated at 1.317 trillion barrels, as of 1 January 2007.
The largest deposits in the world occur in the United States in the Green River Formation, which covers portions of Colorado, Utah, and Wyoming; about 70% of this resource lies on land owned or managed by the United States federal government.
Deposits in the United States constitute 62% of world resources; together, the United States, Russia and Brazil account for 86% of the world's resources in terms of shale-oil content.
These figures remain tentative, with exploration or analysis of several deposits still outstanding.
Professor Alan R. Carroll of University of Wisconsin-Madison regards the Upper Permian lacustrine oil-shale deposits of northwest China, absent from previous global oil shale assessments, as comparable in size to the Green River Formation.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_shaleAnd this might be outdated but:
ANWR is estimated to contain 10.4 billion barrels of recoverable oil, according to the Energy Information Administration.
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 12:29:36pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
I hear ya Noise, but you only have half the equation.
Energy Return On Investment (EROI) is the linch pin here. You need 1.3 bbls worth of energy to extract 1 bbl of shale oil. That is a negative production rate and is unsustainable.
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Poster:
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Edsel |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 12:36:14pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
"You need 1.3 bbls worth of energy to extract 1 bbl of shale oil"
For the sake of discussion, I will assume your numbers are accurate, but they are today's numbers, and are likely to change over time..... I would hope the ratio falls in the future, and the process becomes feasable.
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:25:56pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Unfortunately Edsel, the ratio won't likely fall ever. The denominator is getting smaller faster than the numerator. Energy Return is the only way to look at it accurately. Pro-drillers conveniently exclude the energy cost to extract the kajillion bbls of dead fat dinosaurs and trees when they are shopping their numbers around.
The simple fact is we are consuming a finite resource unabatedly. Eventually that model breaks.
Start here: (But go back and watch the entire Crash Course)
http://www.chrismartenson.com/crashcourse/chapter-17a-peak-oil
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Poster:
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NoiseCollector |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 05:01:57pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Reading this now actually. Thanks.
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 05:51:04pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Noise -
As you might guess, I have become a bit passionate about Crash Course. Let me know what you think, but let's take it off the forum.
mandojamr@yahoo.com
Anytime. I'm really interested in what you think about Chris' work.
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Poster:
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grendelschoice |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 06:38:38pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Mando-
Just FYI I had the pleasure of interviewing Chris a couple years ago...incredibly smart guy & explains a complicated issue in as straightforward a manner as possible. Glad to hear you're into his work!
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 12, 2009 08:33:32am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Grendel -
How cool. I always enjoy the small world connections. Chris and Becca are amazing people, as are their kids. Back in April my wife organized a Crash Course seminar out in SW Virginia in the Shenandoah Mountains. We had 63 people show up to learn from Chris and Becca. Great stuff.
If you interviewed him a couple a years back, you may not have seen the complete version of the Crash Course. I would encourage you to check it out.
Any chance you could provide a copy of the interview - I'd really be interested to hear what he was saying back then. I've only been onboard the Martenson train for a year now.
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Poster:
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grendelschoice |
Date:
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August 12, 2009 08:44:49am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
I'll do my best to track it down for you...it was something I did freelance for Christian Science Monitor and have no idea if it's archived anywhere. (btw, i'm not a Christian Scientist...I always have to point that out when i mention I did some work for them; their international news coverage is second to none)....Will also check on the latest research...The whole oil/shale oil question is a really interesting one, but what is so important to remember is that--as you and Chris pointed out--it always takes energy to extract energy...or, as I think he reminded me at the time: For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Sometimes the simplest laws of physics are the ones we tend to forget.
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Poster:
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skies |
Date:
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August 12, 2009 10:17:15am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Not a convincing argument .You can walk forever and never get anywhere with it ,that's about the only opposite you get ,except when and if IT comes to meet you and send you on elastics cosmic pransters rides,just for the fun or the heck of it . Reasonable wisdom has been on vacations for quite a long time here and it's about TIMES to gig on !
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Poster:
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NoiseCollector |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 12:52:08pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
We could use nuclear power, which is greener than oil or coal. Use it to extract the oil, or use it to replace the oil. I just want me some oil.... I'll squeeze the rocks by hand... gimme some gottdam oil!
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Poster:
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skies |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:03:22pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Take a big Mamma 's advice,and invent something smarter than nuclear gigs if you want something left for the kiddies!!!
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Poster:
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skies |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:12:15pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Historically,it is already known that the main problem on this planet is the incapacity of men to take accout what was is said to them.They'd sooner drop dead definitly back into the big Nothing/nowhere for ever rather than accept opinions others than their headtrips!!!As for the waters,oceans are plenty around,and there are some advanced know how to take the salt out ,without adding to the pollutions .
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Poster:
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NoiseCollector |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 02:51:44pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Desalinization is not advanced or in enough supply to use because of the concentrations of mercury that are building up in the sea water. (pulled this out of my ass truthfully)
Other than Israe, I do not know any country working on or implementing any substantial use or research in it. I do know there are plenty gallons of fresh water frozen at the poles, if only we could think of a way to heat the planet and melt it...
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:23:38pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Sure coal ash is much better. That takes years to die from.
Just don't roll in or eat U238/U235 and you will be fine.
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Poster:
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direwolf0701 |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 02:23:53pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
lol :)
and you are right about the shale oil ratio. got a friend who is an engineer for a big oil firm in texas - he said dont hold your breath for the shale unless you want to be spending $10 a gallon for gas.
(i'll be back in a bit - gotta go snort some coal ash)
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Poster:
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skies |
Date:
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August 12, 2009 02:42:59am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Oil "cvilisation" stinks on the street,and it hurts my breathing ,na !
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Poster:
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Mandojammer |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:24:40pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Perhaps the 4 Horsemen of the Barackalypse will Nationalize the Nuclear industry as well and staff it with retired submariners?
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Poster:
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skies |
Date:
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September 05, 2009 02:36:46am |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Noise Collector found oil to squeeze so too busy to talk back ?
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Poster:
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robthewordsmith |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 01:20:43pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
'ANWR is estimated to contain 10.4 billion barrels of recoverable oil, according to the Energy Information Administration.'
About enough to keep the US going for 16 months. Worth destroying a wilderness to buy a year and change? And then what?
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Poster:
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NoiseCollector |
Date:
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August 11, 2009 02:00:31pm |
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Forum:
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GratefulDead
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Subject:
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Re: You wascily wabbits and your undrilled oil |
Hopefully that will be long enough to invent light without heat and put barfbag/diaper recycling units on the cows. I know someone here who would volunteer for the fittings.
But seriously...
I doubt it would "destroy" the whole area. We have come a long way with angled drilling and exploration and it would be another year of energy.
Then there's natural gas, clean coal, nuclear, the greedy bastards buying and burying patents we never heard of...
The thing about oil that baffles me is that it's totally organic, like coal. It's not like it's synthetic like plastic (which ironically is made from oil which is made from dead animals). It's all carbon. It's all terrestrial. It's already made and in the ground.
Have the dinosaurs died in vain?
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